Datnoids/ Care sheet and ID profiles

Discussion in 'Oddball fish' started by MariaS, Sep 30, 2017.

  1. MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    I have been promising to do this for a while but sometimes there are just not enough hours in they day!!
    Be it as it may... I have finally done it
    Hope you enjoy and its of help to some of you



    DATNOIDS

    Care sheet and profile ID

     Family: Datnioididae

     Genus: Datnioides





    The Gold Datnoid, also commonly known as the Siamese Tigerfish, is a striking fish with yellow body and bold black stripes.

    The vertical stripes and broad, leaf-like body shape give this fish a commanding presence.

    Although commonly known as the Siamese Tiger, there are a few different species that are difficult to identify and tell apart to the inexperienced hobbyist… I still battle sometimes…

    True Siamese Tigers are basically extinct in the wild and very, very rare all over the World as apparently they do not breed in captivity and if you happen to stumble on one they cost an arm and a leg.

    Although there are rumours that there is a farm in Singapore breeding datnoid species, there is no known or registered record of this and its pure speculation…. This is based on all the research I have done

    To be safe, always assume that it could probably be wild caught and even though the exporters are supposed to do this, make sure you quarantine it properly and if possible, run a course of ant parasitic treatment before introducing to your main tank… rather safe than sorry

    Datnoids also referred to as Tigers, are native to various regions in Asia as we will see later in this thread

    They thrive best in waters with a pH between 6.5 and 7.8.

    However, they are hardy fish, so even in slightly acidic or alkaline waters, they will still do well. Again stability is more important than numbers

    Recommended temperature: 25 - 28 °C

    As with most large fish species, the size of the aquarium and adequate filtration are very important as they do produce a lot of bioload

    Although they are relatively slow-growing fish they are large predatory fish most reaching 30cm in captivity (very few specimens recorded at 40cm) and can live up to 10 to 15 years when properly cared for in the home aquarium.

    As I have said, you will need to monitor your water parameters regularly and ensure you have adequate filtration to cope with the bioload they produce

    Regular weekly maintenance is a must,

    They are a rather shy fish at times especially when young and prefer an aquarium that has plenty of open swimming area, and some areas of plants, rocks and driftwood.

    As they grow and get older they become much more outgoing

    They also enjoy current created by a power head simulating the currents in the river

    Though non-aggressive towards other species and can safely be housed with mild mannered cichlids and other fish, they are predators and will eat what fits in their large mouths, they do however often squabble with each other to establish dominancy although not usually to the point of serious injuries.

    In order to disperse aggression it is best to keep more than 2.

    Good tank mates, Asian or silver arowanas, rays, mild mannered cichlids providing they not small enough to be eaten, polypterus, decent sized clown loaches, flagtails, severums, silver dollars etc..

    Just a note… I say mild mannered cichlids because the datnoid does not have teeth, it sucks its prey or food into its mouth which is then digested

    Most cichlids have teeth therefore; very aggressive cichlids can cause serious injury to your Datnoid if they want to, despite his size.

    Funny enough though, most medium aggressive fish back off from the datnoid when he stands still, lifts the spikes on his dorsal fin and stares at the fish.. probably because of his fearless and commanding character..





    Take care when catching or transporting Datnoids.. the spines on his back are sharp and will cause a painful ‘sting’ if you get spiked, they can also easily pierce through the bags when in transport so always double bag and carry with care


    Datnoids are piscivorous, predators with LARGE protruding mouthparts.

    In the aquarium, juveniles can be offered bloodworm, small earthworms, chopped prawn, and you can start trying to introduce pellets while adults will accept strips of fish flesh, whole prawns, mussels, live river shrimp and larger earthworms but if you can…. get them on pellets

    They should not be fed meat such as beeyf heart or chicken since some of the lipids contained in these cannot be properly metabolised by the fish and may cause excess fat deposits and even organ degeneration

    Feeder fish, which could carry with them the risk of parasite or disease introduction and tend not to have a high nutritional value should be avoided

    Once they start eating, they eat like tigers but more often than not, they take time to settle and sometimes on arrival take weeks before they break and start eating especially if they are used to feeders. My larger datnoid did not eat for close to 6 months….. now he eats like a real tiger throwing himself at my hand for his food

    We have also found that small datnoids start eating much sooner than when bought large



    As I have mentioned, datnoids can be rather shy but we have found the silvers to be more outgoing but also a bit aggressive towards other fish especially at feeding time.


    Datnoids have the ability to change colour… they are predator fish at the top of the predator list and their hunting skills are amazing…do not be surprised if you find your Dat hanging upside down against a corner of your tank, behind a filter or piece of wood… he is ok… they assume the most awkward positions you could possible think of.. that’s how they conceal themselves in the wild.. its actually very funny sometimes…


    They can change colour many times throughout the day…In doing this they lose their vibrant yellow colour and go greyish yellow and sometimes almost black. This is referred to as being unstable.

    When they show their nice yellow colour, its said that they are stable.

    It is still a bit of a mystery what exactly causes this but it is believed to be related to settling in to a new environment or disguising themselves to hide from other larger predators.

    We have found that when they amongst the plants or resting under a piece of driftwood or stone, they darken. When they come out and swim around they show their bright yellow colour

    The older they get, ie from about 15cm they appear to become more stable and very outgoing and keep their colour most of the time


    To be continued


     
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  3. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Datnioides pulcher or Siamese Tiger or ST



    Common Names: widebar datnoid, Siamese tigerfish, gold datnoid, tiger datnoid


    Distribution: southeast Asia, specifically Mekong and Chao Phraya river basins

    Description (courtesy of fishbase.org): Distinguishable by its regular color pattern consisting of 3 or 4 or (those collected from the lower Mekong have a 5th bar) regular and broad bars on body; bar 1 from nape through opercle onto thoracic region and across ventral surface of the body; bar 2 from base of dorsal spines 2-5 to slightly in front of anal fin origin; bar 3 starts at base of dorsal spine 9 to base of dorsal ray 2, and ends at base of anal rays 2-6; bar 4 on posterior half of caudal peduncle.



    Photo taken off the internet: tropicalfishkeeping.com









    To be continued
     
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    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Datnioides microlepis- Indo or IT

    Common Names: Indonesian datnoid, , gold datnoid, tiger datnoid

    Max. size: 18 inches, although relatively slow-growing and are long-lived

    .Distribution: southeast Asia, including Chao Phraya and Mekong basins of the mainland and the Kapuas basin in western Borneo and Musi basin in Sumatra.

    Description




    Specimens from mainland Southeast Asia/Sumatra invariably have five full bars (3 body bars), specimens from Borneo 6-7 bars (4 body bars), all usually continued across ventral surface of body. including a curved bar through eye, three or four body bars (depending on location), and three tail stripes or bars.


    The first body bar typically extends through the operculum and crosses the ventral surface. Specimens from Sumatra generally have three body bars, all of which extend across the ventral surface, while specimens from Borneo generally have four body bars, which also cross the ventral surface. Partial bars are almost invariably absent. Branched dorsal rays 14-18; branched anal rays 9-11, usually 10. (Ref. Fishbase.org)


    Indonesian Tiger fish have a tall body with a sharply slanted forehead. The body coloration is dark gold near the dorsal fin and fades to white at the pelvic fin.




    The tricky part is differentiating between Siamese Tiger Fish and Indonesian Tiger Fish. To the untrained eye, they both look the same! The tell-tale sign is the number of stripes on the body. If the body has four black stripes, then it is an Indonesian Tiger. If the body has three black main stripes (discounting the stripes at the eye and tail), then it could be a Siamese Tiger or an Indonesian Tiger.


    In this case where the body has three black stripes, the differentiation in the marking on the tail. If you look at the thinest part of the tail that joins the tail fins to the bofy, you will find 2 small strips. If these two stripes are the same thickness, it is Indonesian Tiger. If the inside stripe is distinctly larger than the outer one, it is Siamese Tiger.



    This is an example of a datnoid which is very difficult for someone with an untrained eye to distinguish and be sure if an ST or Indo


    He is a high quality wide bar Indo

    Photo courtesy of @Cesar 018 (4)indo ces.JPG 019 (3)indo ces.JPG
     
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    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Datnioides Undecimradiatus
    Thinbar Datnoid/Tiger, North Thai Tiger, NTT/ Mekong Tiger



    Distribution: Asia, Mekong basin.




    From the middle and lower Mekong basins in Thailand to Laos, Cambodia, and Vietnam. It has been recorded from several major tributaries including the Xe Bangfai, Mun, and Sekong watersheds.


    Type locality is ‘Mekong River, a few kilometers downstream from Lee Pee (or Khone) waterfalls, Laos’.



    Species info: This species typically has 6 bars or stripes, consisting of a curved bar through the eye, three thin body bars, and two tail stripes or bars. As the common name suggests the bars or stripes on this species are relatively narrow in comparison to other Datnioides. Dorsal spines (total) 12, dorsal soft rays (total) 16-19, anal spines 3, anal soft rays 10-11. (Ref. Fishbase.org),




    As for Northern Thailand Tiger Fish, their stripes are thinner and more spaced out than Siamese Tiger Fish. Often, their golden tone is also not as gold.



    Photo courtesy of @Cesar
    014 (3) ntt cesar.JPG 018 (2)ntt cesar.JPG
     
  7. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    To make it easier to recognize the differences between the Indo and NTT, here are the two next to each other.

    Left is the Indo wide bar/ Right is the NTT

    002 indo ntt.JPG





    Left the NTT/ Right wide bar Indo

    003 (3)indo ntt.JPG
     
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    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Datnioides quadrifasciatus

    Common Names: silver datnoid, /American Tiger : AT



    Distribution: southeast Asia, Indonesia, and New Guinea.

    Description (courtesy of fishbase.org): Dorsal spines (total): 12-12; Dorsal soft rays (total): 13-14; Anal spines: 3-3; Anal soft rays : 8-9. Predorsal profile strongly concave; total gill rakers on first arch 20-23; scales large, about 40-60 in lateral series; anal fin branched rays 9; color pattern highly variable; up to 7 full vertical bars on body, sometimes with 1 to 4 partial bars between full bars (Ref. 10425).

    Temperament: semi-aggressive, more aggressive towards same or similar species.

    Water paramenters: Prefers clean water, pH 7.0-8.0, temperature 76-82 degrees F. This datnoid species although often kept in freshwater prefers light brackish conditions, specific gravity around 1.005, over freshwater environments.


    In an aquarium environment, Silver Tiger Fish can survive in hard, alkaline freshwater for some time, but they are primarily a brackish water species that requires the addition of marine salt to the tank


    Species info: This species typically exhibits a silvery-grey coloration with 7 or 8 bars, including a curved bar through eye, four body bars, and two or three tail stripes or bars. Doral spines (total): 12 - 12; Dorsal soft rays (total): 13 - 14; Anal spines: 3; Anal soft rays: 8 – 9. Pre-dorsal profile strongly concave; Anal fin branched rays 9; colour pattern highly variable,




    It is said that the population from the Indian subcontinent is a dull grey-black in base colour, while the southeast Asian population (presumably both mainland and New Guinea populations) have a white/silver background. This species has up to 7 full vertical bars on body, sometimes with 1 to 4 partial bars between full bars (Ref. Fishbase.org),



    Photo from internet
    upload_2017-9-30_22-30-0.png

    Silver_Datnoid_Tiger_Fish_1.jpg
     
  9. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Datnioides campbelli



    Common Names: New Guinea Tigerfish, Blackfaced Tigerfish, & Green Tiger.


    Max. size: 12.5 inches, although relatively slow-growing

    Environment: freshwater & brackish water

    Distribution:: Restricted to the Gulf of Papua drainages and coastal waters of New Guinea
    Between the Lorentz River in Papua province, Indonesia, and Kikori River in Gulf province, Papua New Guinea. The majority of records pertain to the lower Fly River basin in Western province, south western Papua New Guinea.

    Description: Vertebrae: 24. Has fewer gill rakers than any other Coius. Scales in lateral series 42-43, in transverse series 8-12/1/18-20. First gill arch with 15-17 rakers (vs. 18-21 in C. microlepis and 20-23 in C. quadrifasciatus). Vertebrae 11=13 (vs. 10=14 in all other Coius. Branched anal fin rays usually 10; branched dorsal rays 14-15 (Ref. 10425).

    Biology: Occurs in brackish river mouths, coastal lagoons and rivers above tidal influence.

    Temperament: semi-aggressive, more aggressive towards same or similar species.


    Water paramenters: Prefers clean water, pH 7.0-8.0, temperature 76-82 degrees F. This datnoid species prefers light brackish conditions, specific gravity around 1.005, over freshwater environments.




    They do not travel well and can be tricky to stabilise post-import, often refusing to feed and continuously exhibiting a colour pattern indicative of stress but also displayed at night. In D. campbelli the body darkens considerably and the vertical body bars become indistinct.


    Photo off internet
     
  10. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Just as a matter of interest, some of the chart i have found useful

    TAIL PATTERNs




    New Guinea Tiger ~ NGT

    upload_2017-9-30_22-56-0.png




    Siamese Tiger ~ ST {Some refer to this as CambodianTiger ~CT }




    Indonesian Tiger ~ IT



    upload_2017-9-30_22-57-13.png


    Northen Thailand Tiger ~ NTT {also known as Thin Stripped Tiger}


    upload_2017-9-30_22-57-50.png


    American Tiger ~ AT {also known as American Tiger or Silver Tiger


    upload_2017-9-30_22-58-33.png



    upload_2017-9-30_22-59-15.png



    1-Datonioides pulcher (Purukeru species)--- Siamese Tiger : ST



    2-Datonioides microlepis (Mikurorepisu species) Indonesian Tiger : IT



    3-Datonioides campbelli (New Guinea Datnioides) : NGT



    4-Datonioides undecimradatus (Four bar Tiger): Northern Thailand Tiger : NTT



    5-Datonioides quadrifasciatus (MANY bar Tiger) American Tiger: AT

     
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    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    \


    Distribution Map

    upload_2017-9-30_23-0-26.png



     
  12. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    On a personal note

    I believe the Datnoid is a very underrated fish for those with big tanks that enjoy predator fish

    It can grow to 40cm in a very big tank under optimal conditions but most in captivity are recorded at 30cm

    It is not aggressive towards other fish even mild cichlids like severums, acaras, geos etc..
    Are perfect companions for rays and arowana

    As long as the fish does not fit in its mouth... its safe

    They do tend to be shy and hide a bit while small but once they reach the 12/15cm mark, they become outgoing and friendly

    They have a strong character and are not intimidated and for some reason even fairly aggressive fish leave them alone however, as i said, they dont have teeth and if very aggressive cichlids really really attack them the Datnoid will come off second best..

    All in all a nice fish for a large balanced tank
     
  13. Reedfish

    Reedfish Moderator

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    @MariaS

    Thank you for taking the time to put together this informative article on Dats.
     
  14. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Its a pleasure... hope its helpful .................
     
  15. Duplicareus

    Duplicareus

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    Very interesting.....pity about the size would be a great addition in a smaller package
     
  16. Reedfish

    Reedfish Moderator

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    It is.
    I think one of the main difficulties is correctly identifying the correct species.
    It's vital as a few species prefer brackish conditions long term
     
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  17. Pezulu

    Pezulu

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    That was an interesting read on a species that I have no experience with.
     
  18. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    @Duplicareus .. its actually not so bad.. they don't really grow a lot bigger than a nice big adult Oscar... max in captivity is about 30cm

    Difference is, while Oscar reaches this size maybe.. in.. 18 months? Datnoid will probably take 5 years if not longer to reach that size
    Cesar's wide bar Indo in the above pictures has been with @Cesar ... I think about 4 years... was about 10cm when he got him

    So you can keep one in a 1.5m tank for quite some time..
     
  19. OP
    MariaS

    MariaS Retired Moderator

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    Thanks... glad you enjoyed it..
     
  20. Reedfish

    Reedfish Moderator

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    For me, their ultimate size is what makes them interesting
     
  21. TrevorR

    TrevorR

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    @MariaS Wow you've certainly done your research! Thank you for all the information on a gorgeous species; which I until now had never heard of before! You "lucky fish" for owning a few! I look forward to your updates to this regard, they're different and truly beautiful! Enjoy!
     

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