Endlers or endler hybrids

Ah crap no presure on me then with the one Male I have from you @Vis with the weird colours. I will keep him and 3 females to the side and let them breed a bit till F4 this should be enough to fix the strain right guys?

Gerhard remember last year when I begged you for that one female I was trying to keep your strain going

 

I remember and could not get her to you.

I got her a male and as bad luck would have it she died that same day before I could get home.

Will try and remember who else I gave to that might still have.

 

No problem man we will work this out some howcguru:

 

Hey @Vis got a brainstorm just now, why don't we ask Juan to import some for us?

 

Hein the best option might be to take your male and get 2 young and not yet pregnant females from Shawns friend and start breeding them. They will be pure endlers just a bit confused about their origins

Len I actually wanted to speak to you.

 

We can do that, he might be able to. Will ask if he can and provide their origin.

 

I hope that I am not derailing the thread but here is another photo.

I had to use the flash as these guys were just swimming to fast for the camera today.

The males have all somehow different colour combinations which makes it very interesting.

 

haha dont worry, the thread was derailed like 4 pages ago!! this whole thread from me looking for some endles has turned out to be quite a popular topic for a whole lot of people who seem to be quite passionate about these pretty little buggers. I hope we do all end up getting a few and spreading them out so that the lines can be better preserved because it seems that people seem to lose whole populations of these fish quite quickly, and the more of us that have some the better chance that we keep pure lines of these fish. although i have a huge soft spot for those japan blue hybrids for some reason.

 

well, since we are derailed, hahaahaha, if anybody is looking for any other guppies........ Golden Spade tails, Metallicas or Red Coral Double swords , oh and 5 strains ATFG :laugh:

 

Hey @themasterofSAURON

Sorry that we hijacked your thread, I think its clear that we all love these little fish. We are all just trying to make the point that we would like to keep all the endler lines as pure as possible. Hence the word of caution about getting some of those japan blue hybrids. Go ahead if you like them but please don't cross them back into the endler strain.

Although all of our endlers did get mixed up at the very end we still have a pure endler strain, everyone that got their hands on these endlers incl myself was warned that we need to keep the strain clean and that no normal or ATFG guppies will be cross bred with them. If we did cross them we would discard the name endlers and name them as hybrid guppies.

As for everyone getting some of them good idea and that was exactly what we did, in total if I had to estimate we shared with over 80 fishkeepers if not more. Hence the mixup with who had who's strains, Prof or Gerhards? Most of the endlers we find in SA would most prob be a mix between the two, unless you get them direct from Ashley or the Prof himself.

Hope this clears up any confusion...

Once more sorry for the Hijack

 

Seems like everybody lost my strain.

I bred hundreds of them and now Hein has the only male left.

 

No worries man found him a virgin female they are in a seperate tank as we speak going to get your line going again lol if its the last thing I ever do...(hopefully not going to take that long) lol

Need to get that line going again.

 

@hein24
i have no problem with the hijack, this has been really interesting and helpful to quite a few people.

 

I would also love to get my hands on some of those Endlers, just have to get my tank up and running first. I have one question regarding the breeding. I read the thread "Endlers vs Guppies". I was under the impression that it's bad to breed siblings with siblings and parents with kids. I had a few guppies a few years ago and I tried my best to get males and females from different LPS and not to let them "inbreed" too much. Am I wrong in thinking this? Does it not weaken the strain?

 

@bylaag

It is all dependent on what you would like to do.... If you want to fix a strain you would select the trait you wish to fix in the strain. Then you would need to take the male with the trait for instance and breed him with a female. After doing so you would select one female/male(F1) with the trait you wish to have in your strain and let that male/female pair off with the father/mother of the fry. This would be your (F2) fry and then you would select again one of the fry and let it pair off with the mother/father of the first fry. The fry you get here would be (F3) so you could continue up until the trait you seek for is visable in the fry.

After which you could take any of the brothers/sisters and still crossbreed however this could weaken the strain. I could assure you that 89% of endlers in SA would be those that came from Prof which would be the fry of 2 pairs of endlers if I am not mistaken.

 

Thank you very much, that explains a lot. I think one of my questions was asked wrong. When you inbreed, does it not weaken the fish and make it more prone to diseases?

 

Right, seeing that everyone is putting words into my mouth let me speak up (I am in Germany and will be coming back on Friday, I have got some unfinished fish business here......)

My Endlers originate from a single pair, not two pairs. I think by now there must be a couple of thousand offspring of these in the country.

Inbreeding has different effects in different fishes, in some it leads to problems, the fish get smaller and their immune system suffers such as in discus, but in guppies, as long as the genes are good to start off with, they tolerate inbreeding extremely well and with no problems. After all all fancy strains of guppies are highly inbred and this does not always influence them badly. Certainly in the Endlers I see no effect. In the ATFG guppies I do see quite a lot of inbreeding problems though I would like to add, particularly in the albino strains. One of the problems is that they tend to eat their young and then you do not get any offspring unless you put them into a breeding trap.

Kind regards,

Dirk

 

Sounds like Altums :drool2:

(and that's how rumours get started - LOL)

 

slightly ot - as the thread is about endlers in jhb but the Overberg is covered!!! Got some teenagers from Dirk via Andrew - just finished fishing (pun intended!) 2nd batch of fry out into their grow out tank. They really are cute lil dudes - and yeah, they breed like bunnies! So, a big thanks to @Dirk Bellstedt - first batch already spoken for my side! Endlers take over SA!!!

 

No not Altums,

but carry on drooling....